No doubt this will upset a few devotees but ....
Baga/Calangute beach is my interpretation of holiday hell ! Why anyone wants to spend a day lying on a dirty old mattress you wouldn't retreive from a recycling skip is beyond me. Add to that the crowds, the hassle from the beach sellers, the smell of rubbish and boat fuel. Ok I'm in the minority it seems , as thousands do. Mile after mile of this giant carbuncle on what was once a beautiful beach.The developed area of Baga and Calangute has little of merit in my opinion. On the one occasion we decided to look for somewhere to eat, the bar restaurant we visited had a toilet that was so disgusting I can't believe anyone would eat there. We retreated back to Arpora where we were staying and where standards in all the eating places where maintained.
If, instead of crossing the Baga Bridge from Arpora direction, you continue on, you can walk around the headland to Anjuna beach. Not many do, and consequently the majority miss a walk of outstanding beauty. However, even here in one place, there is a rubbish dump.How very, very sad. Anjuna beach is a vast improvement on Baga as there are far less people in evidence.
On one occasion we hired a cab that dropped at Mandrem beach and we walked the 5 miles or so to Morjim via Ashvem beach. These beaches are pretty well deserted in comparison and the walk is very pleasant along the waters edge. However, as the few shacks along here don't have loos, it's pretty obvious that the sea is their toilet. Evidence of human excrement was all too obvious along the waters edge.
That leads to a similar topic. Baga river flows past the village of Arpora , and all along it's banks people live in various forms of housing, right down to makeshift tents. The river is their toilet. If you get up at daybreak there are plenty of people performing their ablutions on the river bank. High tide washes it down stream. Baga river mouth is a favoured bathing spot, it's been mentioned as a safe bathing spot on HT. I don't think so !
A short distance up stream you can also watch the girls fishing for mussels in the river.In fact you can see where they open the shells, extract the meat and toss them into a bucket of water to keep them fresh. River water.
If you miss the Blackpool of the fifties and sixties, Benidorm and Magaluf of the seventies and eighties, you'll love Baga beach. Cheap as chips with sunshine.
But don't forget the Imodium !
Well said Dave....you took the words right of my mouth.
i suppose thats why its called the third world,but in its defence the north part of goa most defitnally has in abundace bags of charm,we dont eat at the shacks but thats our choice being a chef im hard to please anyway but i know lots of people do and love it,i can only speak about the north goa we found on our first visit to it back in january were going back in 16 days this time for 3 weeks we love it,the world would be very boring if we all liked the same thing,steve.
I agree with everything you say. Don't go back! It's getting too busy anyway! Leave it to us who love it!
hi dave noggin,
First of all India is not a third world country Indians had culture 3000 years before we so called Christians had anything that could be called culture.
If you want to compare Goa with the holiday resorts of the 50/70s that's ok but I bet you went to goa expecting 21st century standards at 19th century prices, me thinks you had better stay in the canaries in the future.
Lez
First of all India is not a third world country Indians had culture 3000 years before we so called Christians had anything that could be called culture.
If you want to compare Goa with the holiday resorts of the 50/70s that's ok but I bet you went to goa expecting 21st century standards at 19th century prices, me thinks you had better stay in the canaries in the future.
Lez
i thought india was a third world country,i was wondering why it wasnt featured on comic relief,i believe africa also had a culture around the same time .
-
Edited by
everton4ever
2007-03-20 18:59:36
That is what adds to the Charm of Goa, I have stayed in five star hotels, and visited wealthy countries, but I have never felt so at home as what I do in Goa, we don't go there to have first class toilets, or high class restaurants, we go there because of the people, and the culture, I have never met such friendly people, no matter how little they have they still have a happy out look on life. We like nothing better than being sat in one of those shacks passing the time away chatting to the local people. I am getting really depressed now, because I have just remembered how long I have to go before I get back there. Roll on November. then 10 Glorious weeks
Hi Lezlie, Actually I didn't expect 21st centuary standards...I've been to other parts of India before and I am aware that they don't seem to have any organised refuse collection system anywhere. The vast majority of rubbish behind Baga beach is a result of our tourism... me included. The fact that I put my litter, no matter how small, in my pocket and took it back to the hotel probably didn't make a jot of difference but at least I tried. The one thing the tourist industry can do is lead by example and demand that certain standards are maintained and an example set for a better future. The proliferation of plastic rubbish now is leaving a terrible legacy for generations to come, and that obviously includes the local population.
As for prices that's another issue. I actually felt guilty at the size of wad I got for £100, a month or more in wages for many locals. I always tip 10% minimum but that also leaves you thinking what harm you are doing to local economics. A single meal tip can be as much as someone earns performing essential services like laying roads etc. so who want's to do that if you can be a waiter ? I am all for redistribution of wealth and tourism is an important tool but I imagine it's also an issue that so many locals are not really locals at all but come from all over India for the season.
Is it any wonder that the Goan state appears to be looking hard at various aspects of the tourist industry, foreign property ownership etc.
If you look what happened to many Spanish holiday resorts who promoted the cheap holiday boom years they have spent many years trying to get rid of the image again. Goa could be making the same mistakes.
As for prices that's another issue. I actually felt guilty at the size of wad I got for £100, a month or more in wages for many locals. I always tip 10% minimum but that also leaves you thinking what harm you are doing to local economics. A single meal tip can be as much as someone earns performing essential services like laying roads etc. so who want's to do that if you can be a waiter ? I am all for redistribution of wealth and tourism is an important tool but I imagine it's also an issue that so many locals are not really locals at all but come from all over India for the season.
Is it any wonder that the Goan state appears to be looking hard at various aspects of the tourist industry, foreign property ownership etc.
If you look what happened to many Spanish holiday resorts who promoted the cheap holiday boom years they have spent many years trying to get rid of the image again. Goa could be making the same mistakes.
dave we helped a load of older europeans clean a beach when we were there last if you go again put your name,steve
"No doubt this will upset a few devotees but ....
Baga/Calangute beach is my interpretation of holiday hell ! Why anyone wants to spend a day lying on a dirty old mattress you wouldn't retreive from a recycling skip is beyond me. Add to that the crowds, the hassle from the beach sellers, the smell of rubbish and boat fuel. Ok I'm in the minority it seems , as thousands do"
If you know it would upset people why post it?
Just because thats your thoughts opinions does it make them right
Sure im not blind and do relate to some of your points but the negativity astounds me in some people.
The internet is a place where emotion is hard to explain i.e. no body language, tone of voice etc but posts like this just make people angry especially when you say "why anyone"...those anyones are US.
Baga/Calangute beach is my interpretation of holiday hell ! Why anyone wants to spend a day lying on a dirty old mattress you wouldn't retreive from a recycling skip is beyond me. Add to that the crowds, the hassle from the beach sellers, the smell of rubbish and boat fuel. Ok I'm in the minority it seems , as thousands do"
If you know it would upset people why post it?
Just because thats your thoughts opinions does it make them right
Sure im not blind and do relate to some of your points but the negativity astounds me in some people.
The internet is a place where emotion is hard to explain i.e. no body language, tone of voice etc but posts like this just make people angry especially when you say "why anyone"...those anyones are US.
Surfstak, this is after all a discussion forum, a forum where people can visit to find out different opions about holiday destinations.I have no doubt there are a lot of people who disagree with some of my sentiments ( the reason I mentioned it in my initial post), however, anyone who hasn't been to Baga can at least read two differing opinions and make their own minds up about the suitability of the destination.
To me it is more Paradise Lost than Paradise Found.
To me it is more Paradise Lost than Paradise Found.
Ok all - let's keep things friendly and not get personal.
Remember one mans meat, is another man's posion.
Lets agree to differ
Kath HT Admin
Remember one mans meat, is another man's posion.
Lets agree to differ
Kath HT Admin
May i just re-iterate Lezlie's point. India is not a third world country and i think many Indians would take umbrage at the insinuation.
India has nuclear wepons and plenty nuclear power.
India has 340,000,000 people living middle class.
India has reportedly more billionaires in the world excluding the US and the second richest man in the world after our beloved Mr. Gates
The delights and pitfalls of modern day India are of their own making, the caste system (still alive and kicking) being the main contributor to what we as tourists see as poverty. You will have all seen the picture of vast wealth, ie, Kingfisher Villa and Jimmy the Diamond's gaff but overall Goa has not got the infrastructure to cope with the vast influx of tourism, and unfortunately the "tourist dollar" due mainly to corruption, is not always put back into the tourist industry, therefore what we get is what some people see as sub-standard services.
Whatever your views on Goa are, you can never deny it is a vibrant, colourful and at times magical and an ever changing picture.
A good friend of mine, a worldy traveller, once described India with the following phrase, and i think Goa can be included......"Most days you love and embrace her, somedays you just want to vomit her back up".
But we all keep returning, and hopefully for those that require european comforts, standards may improve, but for those that remember Goa from years back, and still look for a laid back and chill break,well there are still plenty of ways to escape the so called declining areas as is Baga.
India has nuclear wepons and plenty nuclear power.
India has 340,000,000 people living middle class.
India has reportedly more billionaires in the world excluding the US and the second richest man in the world after our beloved Mr. Gates
The delights and pitfalls of modern day India are of their own making, the caste system (still alive and kicking) being the main contributor to what we as tourists see as poverty. You will have all seen the picture of vast wealth, ie, Kingfisher Villa and Jimmy the Diamond's gaff but overall Goa has not got the infrastructure to cope with the vast influx of tourism, and unfortunately the "tourist dollar" due mainly to corruption, is not always put back into the tourist industry, therefore what we get is what some people see as sub-standard services.
Whatever your views on Goa are, you can never deny it is a vibrant, colourful and at times magical and an ever changing picture.
A good friend of mine, a worldy traveller, once described India with the following phrase, and i think Goa can be included......"Most days you love and embrace her, somedays you just want to vomit her back up".
But we all keep returning, and hopefully for those that require european comforts, standards may improve, but for those that remember Goa from years back, and still look for a laid back and chill break,well there are still plenty of ways to escape the so called declining areas as is Baga.
Everyone's views are equally valid, and surely one of the purposes of this forum is to give people an opportunity to express them, and i have mostly enjoyed reading this thread.
Nobody who knows and cares about Goa can be unconcerned by the unplanned nature of the over development that is going on. Garbage and sewage are serious issues which the authorities need to tackle.
The recent successful agitation againist the proposed Regional Development Plan (which would basically have sold Goa to property developers) shows that Goans are also (belatedly) waking up to the threat that Goa faces from development.
Even a quick visit to the main Calangute/Baga beach strip shows that there are clearly many developmenet issues which need urgently addressing.
Still, as others have pointed out, there are many other parts of Goa which have not yet suffered such development. Let's hope they can stay that way!
There are elections in May. Maybe Goa will finally get some elected representatives who care about Goa as much as those of us who live here, or come back to visit year after year. We can but hope.
Nobody who knows and cares about Goa can be unconcerned by the unplanned nature of the over development that is going on. Garbage and sewage are serious issues which the authorities need to tackle.
The recent successful agitation againist the proposed Regional Development Plan (which would basically have sold Goa to property developers) shows that Goans are also (belatedly) waking up to the threat that Goa faces from development.
Even a quick visit to the main Calangute/Baga beach strip shows that there are clearly many developmenet issues which need urgently addressing.
Still, as others have pointed out, there are many other parts of Goa which have not yet suffered such development. Let's hope they can stay that way!
There are elections in May. Maybe Goa will finally get some elected representatives who care about Goa as much as those of us who live here, or come back to visit year after year. We can but hope.
Ok- I've just seen this thread and want to re-iterate what Kath has said. Everybody can not like the same places( just think, if they did, we would never get a hotel booked! 
). Everyone is entitled to their views- I don't think anyone who has done any research before they go thinks Goa is perfect. Even with research and going with that attitude, people can be disappointed. Lets just comment without being personal though please.
). Everyone is entitled to their views- I don't think anyone who has done any research before they go thinks Goa is perfect. Even with research and going with that attitude, people can be disappointed. Lets just comment without being personal though please.
The poster is giving an opinion - and that's ALL it is. It's a discussion forum.
I agree with most of what the original post says.
I'm glad it's been said.
My attitude to Goa is very selfish - I only eat at restaurants where I have checked out the kitchens, and usually the ones I like are foreign owned and don't have plastic seats.
I can't understand why so many Brits are happy to sit amongst filth and rubbish that they wouldn't tolerate in the UK - just because it's Goa.
I am very particular about which shacks I use, again I check out the toilets and general hygene in the food preparation area.
I always rent a scooter and sometimes a car also - essential to escape the mayhem of that Baga/Calangute strip.
I return to the same accommodation every year because I know it's clean and is situated in a quiet area.
All of the above is only my opinion by the way.
I'm glad it's been said.
My attitude to Goa is very selfish - I only eat at restaurants where I have checked out the kitchens, and usually the ones I like are foreign owned and don't have plastic seats.
I can't understand why so many Brits are happy to sit amongst filth and rubbish that they wouldn't tolerate in the UK - just because it's Goa.
I am very particular about which shacks I use, again I check out the toilets and general hygene in the food preparation area.
I always rent a scooter and sometimes a car also - essential to escape the mayhem of that Baga/Calangute strip.
I return to the same accommodation every year because I know it's clean and is situated in a quiet area.
All of the above is only my opinion by the way.
Dave
how was the trip to Wildernest?
how was the trip to Wildernest?
hi all,
i think dave wales has a very valid point,and i also think it's great that he's views differ so much from the majority of members posting in this thread,surely we must see and hear peoples views,for and against a holiday destination,only then can people make up their own minds as to weather it's the right place for them,i was thinking about going to goa next year for our holiday,but now i am having second thoughts,i was reading the posts on the forum through blinkers i think,my gf didn't want to go,but i twisted her arm,and told her all about the good points that i had read,but now i feel this would not be the right destination for us,were no snobs but we work very hard and save all year long,as we all do,just so we can spend 2wks away,and for us we like to have very nice accomodation,eat in good resturants,sunbathe on clean beaches and hate being pesterd by sellers,so although the original post has upset some people,i for one am glad it was posted,i'm not knocking goa,as iv'e never been,but i would not want to go now and end up hating it,we did that with kenya,so i think we will be returning to turkey once again,where i know we will enjoy ourselves,at the end of the day it's horses for courses i think,and it realy is a good thing that we all like different destinations,or we would never get on the beach would we,happy hols everyone,where ever they might be.
i think dave wales has a very valid point,and i also think it's great that he's views differ so much from the majority of members posting in this thread,surely we must see and hear peoples views,for and against a holiday destination,only then can people make up their own minds as to weather it's the right place for them,i was thinking about going to goa next year for our holiday,but now i am having second thoughts,i was reading the posts on the forum through blinkers i think,my gf didn't want to go,but i twisted her arm,and told her all about the good points that i had read,but now i feel this would not be the right destination for us,were no snobs but we work very hard and save all year long,as we all do,just so we can spend 2wks away,and for us we like to have very nice accomodation,eat in good resturants,sunbathe on clean beaches and hate being pesterd by sellers,so although the original post has upset some people,i for one am glad it was posted,i'm not knocking goa,as iv'e never been,but i would not want to go now and end up hating it,we did that with kenya,so i think we will be returning to turkey once again,where i know we will enjoy ourselves,at the end of the day it's horses for courses i think,and it realy is a good thing that we all like different destinations,or we would never get on the beach would we,happy hols everyone,where ever they might be.
Fiona I think you should have a post for people who hate goa and wont be going back .........I have been a member on H/Ts just over a year and I cant say I have ever ever seen anyone say that they hate it and will never go back ....to all you people who have never been it is a magic place and there is NO WAY ...you will not like it .............colleen
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